UPDATE: Interview with Lib Dem candidate...

Adam Symons, Lib Dem candidate for Torridge and West Devon, speaks to Adam Wilshaw from the North Devon Journal during the 2010 general election campaign.

IN THIS EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW:
You’re not voting for a Government; you’re voting for an MP/ "We’ve had 18 years of Conservative government and nothing ever happened for us in the South West" / "People really hate the squabbling" / "The Lib Dem proposals to raise tax thresholds to £10,000 is a very popular policy"/ "I’m not tainted by second jobs. Geoffrey Cox has earned over £80,000 in his second job over the last three years"

Question: Why should anybody vote for a candidate whose party has no realistic chance of forming a Government?
They’re not voting for a Government. What they’re voting for is an MP to represent them in their local area. I pledge to be a full-time MP. I’m locally born and bred. I will be here for everybody and will work for everybody, regardless of their politics.

Question: The argument made by local Conservative candidates is they are very confident there is going to be a Conservative Government. Their argument is if there’s going to be a Conservative Government, they will have the ear of the Government.
It’s never worked in the past. We’ve had 18 years of Conservative government and nothing ever happened for us in the South West. You can’t trust the Tories to make anything happen in the South West. They don’t even have cabinet minister from the South West.

Question: Many people are predicting a hung parliament. Would you prefer to share power with Labour or the Conservatives?
Nick Clegg has said its the public who provide the mandate. We will look to work in the interests of the country, whatever needs to be done.

Question: So you’re taking a pragmatic view on that rather than an ideological one?
We’re a pragmatic party, made up of local people. We are about common sense politics and about representing ordinary people. We don’t get funding from billionaires from people who might not pay tax in this country.

Question: What have you made of the campaign so far?
People really hate the squabbling. People want a bit of consensus politics. They want people to start working together. The country is in a bit of a mess and they want people to put aside the squabbles and let’s have some decent politics. Let’s have people like Vince Cable who everybody trusts and knows to be part of that.

Question: Torridge is a rural one. What are the major issues facing the countryside in your constituency and how would your policies address them?
Torridge and West Devon is a very diverse constituency and there are different problems in different areas. In the very rural areas public transport is a big issue.

Wages are very low. The Lib Dem proposals to raise tax thresholds to £10,000 is a very popular policy here given that our average wages are so low. We have also made a pledge to make sure schools get extra funding through the pupil premium which would give £26million more to Devon. We know people have concerns about things like fuel prices and we have said we would cut fuel duties by 50% in rural areas to enable people to survive.

I’m very concerned about fuel poverty. There are so many issues. My job is to listen and take them all on board and not present them as a single issue but work for the different people in the different areas.

Question: The policy idea about fuel duty: could that not cause resentment in urban areas still paying full whack on their duty?
I don’t think so because I think if you travel 60 miles round trip just to get to a shop I think people understand there are no other ways of getting there. There is very little public transport. People understand that rural areas are crying out for a bit of help.
Question: What are your views on some of the things the farming community talk about: bovine TB, for example?
I’m a farmer’s son and I’ve worked the land. I talk to a lot of farmers and I think the consensus is we need a proper controlled testing system backed up by a selective cull, which identifies where we have TB problems, both in badgers and in cattle, and we look at how you control that. We can test badgers and look at those clusters.

I also know farmers who’ve farmed for years who have got no badger sets on their land and no TB problems and are very resistant to the idea of a badger cull. We have to take a balanced view and the science backs that up.

Question: And another farming issue: common agricultural policy?
The CAP and commons fisheries policy (CFP) and other areas of Europe need reform. We have been calling for that reform for years. Europe, much like our own Government, there are things there which just don’t work and we need to sort them out and we need to clean it up. People don’t trust either institution.

Question: Is it the model of the system that isn’t working with CAP or is it the amounts involved or...?
It’s the model and it’s the same for the European parliament; it doesn’t work particularly well with the European Commission. The same for CFP. I’ve worked with marine scientists and they say politicians aren’t listening to the scientists about how this should work.

Question: What would be a helpful alternative to the CAP and CFP?
There have been some very good policy papers set out by CFP scientists who say you are going to have to tighten up the quotas in certain areas ; you are going to have to make sure that countries are limited by the catches they have in certain areas.

At the moment we are seeing fish populations go through the floor and if we keep doing what we’re doing we are not going to have any fish left.

That’s the stark reality of it all. I don’t know enough about CAP to give a coherent answer.

Question: Moving onto the economic problems we’ve had. The Lib Dems have promised to "break up the banks" to end the sort of casino capitalism which sparked the recession; how would you do that?
Effectively it means you are taking some of the biggest banks, which are running a monopoly situation over mortgages and other things, and you break them up into smaller entities. In this country the big banks control vast proportions of the retail and investment banking sector; this doesn’t happen in other countries. In Germany there is a huge choice of banks you can bank with and competition.

Question: How would you compare that with what Labour has done?
I don’t think Labour have taken enough forceful action to deal with the monopoly situation. This isn’t about the people who work in the banking sector; this is about structural reform. They’ve gone down the same route the Conservatives went down which is deregulation of the banking sector. The problem with that is when you get super-banks you can’t regulate them; they have absolute control. We have for years called for proper regulation. I’ve had local people crying out saying the banks won’t lend them any money. Why? Because they don’t need to, because they’ve got control of the money stream.

Question: What’s your view on the Government being condemned for pouring billions of money into the banks for them to do with what they like?
The Government had to do what they did. They had to prop up an economy. If they didn’t do it we probably would have seen a 1930s style depression. If we had followed the advice of the shadow chancellor, George Osborne, who said we should have cut public spending, we would have gone into a 1930s recession. It’s not palatable but it had to happen. Now we have to pay it back but if it hadn’t been done it would have been a lot worse.

Question: You agree with what the Government did in terms of "bailing out the banks"?
There was no other choice. Every other country in the world did it. What happened in the 1930s is we didn’t do it.

Question: Has it had the effect it was expected to have?
Well it stopped the collapse of the financial system. If that had collapsed and there had been no credit for businesses then they would have gone under as well.

Question: The Lib Dems want to scrap the Child Trust Fund. Labour say that shows your party doesn’t share its progressive agenda in the sense of wanting to reduce poverty?
If you want to reduce poverty you should let people keep more of the money they earn. The £10,000 tax threshold raise means that nearly everybody in Torridge and West Devon will be £700 better off a year. That’s a way of making sure people keep more money in their pockets and that’s a way of reducing poverty, not by giving somebody a one-off payment and giving everybody the same amount.

Question: Labour have a lot of store in their early years spending, Sure Start...
All the research indicates that investing in early years education is the right way to go. We support Sure Start and we believe it is the right way to go. We would like to say more investment in early years education and smaller class sizes.

Question: Your policies state that one of the reasons for the recession was the soaring house prices...
We would link house price inflation, back with normal inflation because if that would have happened we’d have seen the Bank of England target inflation much better. We can’t presume house price inflation is something outside the system.

Question: How would that work practically, as a mechanism?
It’ll link in with the retail price index. Currently, the Government targets inflation and house price inflation isn’t linked into any indices. You might see low inflation because we get a lot of goods imported from China but internally we are seeing high inflation and that causes us bubbles and it was that housing bubble which burst which caused the problems.

Question: What measures could a Government take though?
Dampen inflation. They already have measures, by using interest rates to target inflation.

Question: So, higher interest rates?
It depends. It’s about stable interest rates. It’s not about having bubbles. If you lower interest rates, you get bubbles. What people want, what businessess want, is a stable economy. They want to know where they stand from year to year.

Question: What can be done to help people here get affordable homes to buy or rent?
I would like to see local authorities have more control over housing development.

It would be great if they could be the brokers and provide masterplans which had more affordable housing within and made sure they happened.

Far too much land has been sold off and the residual value of that land has been pocketed by a few and it hasn’t been retained within the public sector system to create roads, infrastructure.

It’s one of the biggest underlying issues in places like Holsworthy and Torrington and Bideford; when new housing is built, infrastructure has not been provided.

Question: Would the Lib Dem like extra funding to be channelled down to local government to help them do that?
We would like local government to have more responsibility for providing that housing. The problem with saying we want more money is we’re not certain of what the budget’s going to be. It’s got to be commensurate with what we’ve got to provide and that requires detailed housing surveys.

Question: This is a tricky balancing act for politicians with regard to house prices because a lot of doors you’ll knock on will be delighted their property has doubled price in three years but next door is a young family who can’t afford to get on the housing ladder...
It’s a false economy. For all of these things what we need is a stable economy so people feel secure in their homes and aren’t using their homes as some kind of pension pot, because it’ll all end up in tears. House prices can’t go up forever. They can’t go up at a greater rate than wages go up forever because that’s impossible.

Question: The Lib Dems want to restore the earnings link on pensions. Is there not a danger that would cost a fortune just as the public finances are taking a massive dent?
It’s not going to happen just like that. We’ve had this aspiration for a good 30-odd years. The link was broken in the 1980s. I see OAPs really struggling and I don’t want to see that and they feel as though they have been insulted by successive governments.

Question: The Lib Dems have desire for a green infrastructure (no nuclear or "dirty coal"). Are you confident that will be able to provide the country with all of the energy it needs?
All the research shows that’s possible. The science is proven. It’s a question of investing the money in the infrastructure. We’ve fallen behind other countries.

We talk about talking about investing in things like Trident I’ve got friends who’ve worked on the submarines and they say Trident is a waste of money.

If this country wants to be sustainable it should be investing in other things. It’s Lib Dem policy not to replace Trident.

Question: Climate change. Parties like UKIP and some Conservatives fall within the camp of believing it’s a hoax. What are your views?
I’m an environmental scientist and 14 years ago I was giving presentations on the impacts of methane and carbon dioxide on the atmosphere.

The science is absolutely proven in terms of the impact it has. The question is: what does that mean? That’s the difficult bit. But it’s one of the biggest challenges we are going to be facing and how we work together to stop the climate changing. We are already seeing it.

We’re already seeing desertification in Africa. We’re seeing increased number of extreme weather events. This isn’t a hoax. I’m sure your grandfather says to you I’m sure daffodils never came out at this time of year when I was a lad.

There’s natural fluctuations, year to year, but the underlying science is absolutely right. I think there’s a problem with people in this country understanding the issues and part of that comes from an education system which hasn’t encouraged children to challenge and to learn.

There’s a lot more which could be done to work with people to help them understand the impacts of climate change.

Question: The Lib Dems want elected health and police authorities. A criticism is made of that is that these people who are elected could spend all their time politicking when they should be running the organisations in question?
I don’t think so. Councillors aren’t always campaigning and politicking. It’s about representing local people.

We moan about the police doing this or that but we have little control of what they do. Do we want everything run by central Government?

Do we want national MPs taking control of decisions over all our lives or do we want power divesting down to local communities?

Question: That has a bit of common ground with that the Conservatives have been saying.
They’ve said it. I think they’ve said 20-odd times over the years but it’s never actually happened and they’ve got no track record of localism in this country. The time they were in Government they centralised many things.

Question: Are you confident that a local income tax would generate enough revenue for local authorities to be able to provide excellent services?
Council tax is a regressive tax. The bottom 20% of people pay a much higher proportion of their income on council tax than the top 20%.

People feel the banding system doesn’t work. You have to remember most of the money local authorities spend does not come through local taxation.

Having a local income tax will allow local authorities to set something based on their local circumstances. It’s about empowering local people.

Question: Would that not mean, though, that in areas with lower incomes the Government would have to pour in more money?
At the moment that happens anyway. It allows local authorities to decide what are their priorities and for something like local income tax we have set it at a framework of 3% and 4% which would have greater benefits for places like Torridge because we pay a much greater proportion of money in council tax because our wages are much lower.

With local income tax we would be paying a proportionally fairer amount to everybody in the country.

Question: Given the Lib Dems are keen to divest more power locally, as you say, what’s wrong with the argument with saying if all this is going to be funded by the Government eventually why not have one income tax?
This isn’t funded by the Government. This is funded by you and me. We pay our income tax and we’ve got no idea where it goes. It goes into one giant pot. If we said we’re paying a local income tax and we see where it’s going, we have much control and connection with our local representatives.

Question: A question throughout the campaign is about cutting waste. But that’s a lot of hot air isn’t it? Politicians always say this and it never happens?
Sometimes it is hot air but it’s not impossible to do. There are some very good practitioners in the field of lean thinking. Thinking about how you do things better. I know some of them and we have squeezed costs out of different areas. It’s not about cuts. It’s about making the system leaner. In can be done. It’s a question of having the willpower. Governments have promised they would do it and haven’t always delivered.

Question: Give me some examples of this lean thinking?
Imagine a small example. You have a planning department in a local authority. It’s about looking at the whole process from stat to finish and saying how do we streamline this. In the same way you were doing recycling, you would look at the system and say: are we double-handling stuff?

Question: How would that save costs?
You’re saving costs in terms of time and you are going to save costs in terms of manpower and in terms of energy and resources. There are going to be, at points, job losses, but there’s no point employing people in a system which is wasting.

Question: Labour say that if you’re talking about redundancies in the public sector the cost savings are cancelled out by the cost of those people re-entering the labour market again.
Which is why the Tory idea that they’re going to make cost savings just like that is nonsensical. All they are going to be doing is putting people on the dole and effectively that will be drawing money out of social security. It’s got to be done sensitively which is the whole point of having a programmed plan and at the same time you are looking at things like investment in infrastructure because then you’re creating jobs as well.

It’s all about having a balanced, managed economy. George Osborne said at the beginning of the recession "we’re going to cut lots of money"; I despair with the idea he could be chancellor because he doesn’t have a clue what he’s talking about.

Question: How will the Lib Dems pay for the extra £2.5billion the party has promised for schools?
I’m confident it’s all costed and the media is confident it’s all costed because Vince Cable went onto Radio Four with a whole sheet of the cost savings we’re going to make.

They’re fully costed and this is what they pay for. On the doorstep Vince Cable is probably the only trusted MP in this country.

Question: What’s your view on Labour’s plan for a national care service?
We need a national care service; it’s a question of how that is delivered. It doesn’t have to be purely funded by income tax. It can be funded in partnership with people. What people want to know is what is expected of them.

They know they are going to have to put away a bit of money for their old age. But they also want the Government to be able to support them as well.

Question: Some people say it might sound like an expensive plan?
We’re paying for care anyway. It’s not as if we haven’t got a national care service. It’s just that it’s buried in social services. It’s a question of how do we make it more sustainable.

Question: There is some resentment in your constituency about the role of the European Union. Do you view the EU and EC as worthwhile and effective organisations?
I don’t them as view them as particularly effective but I view Europe as an essential way of moving forward in a world which is international and in which we have common problems which we have to solve.

There are significant problems in the EU, such as fisheries. There are significant problems with the way it is audited. Unless you are in Europe you can’t reform it.

Terrorism, trafficking, immigration, climate change; the only way we are going to solve them is by working with Europe.

Question: Can I ask you for your views on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan?
We were the only party dead against going into Iraq and I think we were justified because I think the reasons for going in were the wrong reasons.
Afghanistan is a lot more complicated. We’re there under a UN mandate as part of a multinational force. We are making a difference there.

We’ve made too many mistakes. We have not had a clear and coherent policy with what we should be doing, so we’ve been doing great stuff in Helmand and it needs coherence.

I’m disappointed we have tried to build a centralised government in a country which is incredibly localised. I don’t know whether we can build the success we want to build. It’s incredibly complicated. The situation is changing very quickly.
We made some fundamental mistakes. We thought we could introduce western style governments on a country which has only ever seen localism and tribalism.
You can be successful in Afghanistan but only on the basis of going in and out in a very short period of time and reading the landscape well.
The majority of the people in Afghanistan are very supportive of the work of the UN. We can’t stop supporting them. Our soldiers do an amazing job.
What we need to make sure we don’t do is leave a void for Al Queda to enter.

Question: It seems in the early days of the campaign that the Lib Dems were taking the Obama route of repeating a mantra of change. Nick Clegg is always using the word change. But is that empty rhetoric, because change cannot be a good thing in and of itself?
Absolutely. We say change that works for you. What people want in this country is change but they want change so that people have better lives. They don’t want change for the sake of it. In Torridge and West Devon it’s a fresh start. We haven’t had a locally-born MP here and I pledge to be full-time. I’m not tainted by expenses. As far as I’m concerned, if somebody gave me a job they would expect me to do that job full-time for them, and be fully committed; they wouldn’t expect me to go off and do another job.

Question: What sort of political credence does being born somewhere give you? What difference does it make?
I understand what it’s like living here and I understand what it’s like being born and brought up here and I know the area. I can associate with lots of different people. People get fed up with people being pulled down from other parts of the world. Nick Harvey knows his local area and he’s a bloody good MP. He’s been here for an incredibly long period of time.

Question: Public perception of MPs at an all time low. What will you and your party do to improve the poor state of democracy in Britain?
It’s a rotten system. I’ve been disgusted with it, frankly. We want to make sure if people think their MP has done something wrong, they have the power to sack them. Issues over lobbying and expenses and second jobs and funding through people who don’t pay tax in this country is cleaned up. We also want to see a reduction in the number of MPs.

And also we want to see a voting system which means people’s votes actually count because at the moment I’m meeting people who are voting something they don’t want to vote because the voting system doesn’t do anything for them.

I’m not a great fan of proportional representation; I prefer the alternative vote system which means you keep constituency MPs.

Question: How will electing you improve the lives of people in Torridge and West Devon?
They can see my work as a councillor. I’ve made things happen in Hartland and Bradworthy. I listen to people and do the things they want me to do. It isn’t about my opinions; it’s about representing other people. It’s about being here.

Question: This is going to be a close election here isn’t it?
Closer in Torridge than in North Devon. I’ve had a Conservative councillor in North Devon say he thought Nick Harvey was bomb-proof. The odds are shortening in Torridge and West Devon.